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  • Jan Wildeboer 😷:krulorange:jwildeboer@social.wildeboer.net
    Jul 3, 2026, 6:07 AM

    HN discusses PeerTube, and the first reply starts with „As a professional YouTuber, the main issue I instantly see with this is the lack of monetization.“

    And I immediately think: so maybe that’s the thing we should focus on. Keep that kind of monetisation out to create a place for those that don’t compete for money, but for quality. Yes, I’m that naive, but the Fediverse is an alternative to many things, not a drop-in replacement to for-profit services to me.

    news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4

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Replies

  • Jan Wildeboer 😷:krulorange:jwildeboer@social.wildeboer.net
    Jul 3, 2026, 6:15 AM

    People have complained about the lack of influencers on the Fediverse, because they struggle to create the kind of audience they have on commercial, centralised networks. I actually see that as an advantage. I find far more interesting people here, because we have deeper, direct dialogue and discussions. Its more bottom-up, less top-down around here. I like!

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  • Jan Wildeboer 😷:krulorange:jwildeboer@social.wildeboer.net
    Jul 3, 2026, 7:16 AM

    In my personal and biased opinion, the Fediverse, by its very nature, acts as a normaliser of networked communication. By externalising monetisation, it delivers a baseline that fosters communities over cults, so to say. Which is why I never liked the term „follower“, BTW. It is technically correct, but on a psychological level it sends the wrong message, again, in my personal opinion. Anyway, enough philosophy for today, back to work :)

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  • Chris 🦑sturmsucht@mastodon.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 6:34 AM

    @jwildeboer 100%. Sometimes this feels like nobody ever made money before the invention of walled-gardened social media.

    Or maybe the job as YouTuber turned out to be not a job at all. I mean, if your job descriptions include a specific service, this won't work outside of that service. Surprise.

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  • Leszekmakdaam@chaos.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 6:52 AM

    @jwildeboer It's not only a matter of creating an audience. Youtubers with large followings tried to stay on Fedi, but got overwhelmed by the spam and harassment.

    Centralized networks offer a lot of free help to nurture the celebrity culture. If you'd like to do the same on Fedi you'll need to find yourself a moderator team. A good example is Alec who was open about his experience here mas.to/@TechConnectify/1129953

    So in my opinion the services have completely different fundamental goals.

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  • Leszekmakdaam@chaos.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 6:59 AM

    @jwildeboer Youtube/centralized social media are chasing numbers of views or number of followers, then making sure that having a large following is sustainable.

    Over here it's not even a point to consider. The distribution of high bandwidth content is an interesting technical problem, but that's about it.

    So even if "deliver video" is the same technical feature, Youtube and PeerTube will always go in different directions when it comes to human relations.

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  • ananasananas@scicomm.xyz
    Jul 3, 2026, 6:56 AM

    @jwildeboer This is my main reason to actually participate in Fediverse.

    I always was quite uninterested in other microblogging services, since all I saw was people screaming into the void and hoping somebody hears them.

    Here I've actually had conversations that have even managed to change my mind about some things. (Well, I'm stubborn so it's not common, but it has happened!)

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  • Baglavabaglava@mastodon.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 7:01 AM

    @jwildeboer Wer braucht denn diese Dummschwätzer, die sich einbilden, sie wären Medienstars? Solche Leute standen früher vor dem Kaufhof und versuchten, den Leuten Zeug anzudrehen. Da waren manchmal echte Showtalente darunter. Aber das weiß heute kaum noch jemand.

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  • Leelooleeloo@c.im
    Jul 3, 2026, 9:54 AM

    @jwildeboer
    GNU has the expression "free as in freedom, not as in beer".

    Maybe we need to adopt something like "follower as in RSS, not as in religious".

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  • BrahvimBrahvim@mastodon.gamedev.place
    Jul 3, 2026, 9:57 AM

    @jwildeboer
    Hmmm. It should say "Friend" ^-^")! /s
    ...Or something neutral that still means "member" or "fellow user", but... also represents the "following"!

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  • scattershotscattershot@merveilles.town
    Jul 3, 2026, 11:51 AM

    @jwildeboer i really like it for the place where I don’t want to monetise, but hang out with interesting people and look at interesting things. That’s the USP for me. I monetise elsewhere it I need to.

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  • FayeFayeDrake@furry.engineer
    Jul 3, 2026, 1:34 PM

    @jwildeboer I think you’ve just convinced me to get on PeerTube.

    Difference between “art” and “content”.

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  • mike morrismikro2nd@indieweb.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 7:35 AM

    @jwildeboer Fully agree, and, that said, I think a useful question is: What features/dynamics inherent in Fedi make it difficult or impossible for people to become "influencers"? And then we ought to amplify, strengthen, reinforce those features/dynamics and actively deprecate any that encourage an "influencer" culture.

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  • bovaz@misskey.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 7:58 AM
    @jwildeboer@social.wildeboer.net I'm not aware of any technological thing in the fediverse that would prevent influencers and businesses and such to find a place here. It's probably more of a culture thing.
    I could see a business/influencers "trunk" of instances grow across the fediverse, connected to what's there already.
    Monetization, if it happens, would have to change: the way ads are delivered would have to be substantially different, thanks to decentralization. That is an opportunity, in a sense: I know I don't want ads to spam me continuously, but businesses (that I don't know nor follow) want to tell me about them, and finding a different meeting point there would be a challenge.
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  • da_667da_667@infosec.exchange
    Jul 3, 2026, 6:17 AM

    @jwildeboer I like how they bitch about a lack of monetization, but most of the best youtubers I watch are usually demonetized quite frequently and acquire most of their money from external subscriptions. Twitch, Patreon, etc because youtube's rules are arbitrary, what is advertiser-friendly content one day, is unacceptable for monetization the next. That's on top of their copyright strike system being terrible, and most of the time, very unfair for most creators to deal with. Companies can copyright strike at will, and indefinitely with very few consequences.

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  • da_667da_667@infosec.exchange
    Jul 3, 2026, 6:25 AM

    @jwildeboer Either they get external monetization to where they don't have to deal with copyright strikes/arbitrary "is it advertiser safe or not" bullshit, or the alternative is getting placement deals in the videos. Either way, youtube isn't paying because google doesn't pay.

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  • Glog78glog78@digitalcourage.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 6:19 AM

    @jwildeboer

    Imho -> let them complain about missing monetization . If that is their issue it means they get money from advertisment and not money by the people who consume their content. If there are enough people consuming their content and are willing to pay they will be ok with giving money thru patreon or some other similar sites. They might even find sponsors ...

    So just let them go to other platforms , till they understand why PeerTube is how it is and that no money is exactly how it should be.

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  • Fire Horse 2026blakefox@mastodon.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 6:20 AM

    @jwildeboer my neighbor worked as an accountant for Proctor & Gamble,likely one of Youtubes largest advertisers. Google runs their YouTube monetization with similar traits as casinos. It’s best to not bother and find your own resources. Unless you have a weird fetish for shiny plaques.

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  • Patricklordkhan@social.cologne
    Jul 3, 2026, 6:23 AM

    @jwildeboer I’m with you. If I want entertainment, I watch telly or YouTube for this matter, but that’s not my intention with the Fediverse.

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  • Alex Dufournetalex@dfnt.fr
    Jul 3, 2026, 6:32 AM

    @jwildeboer wouldn't it be fantastic if we had a means of remunerating creators, platform admins and maintainers?

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  • Jiří Eischmannsesivany@vivaldi.net
    Jul 3, 2026, 7:11 AM

    @jwildeboer it isn't the lack of monetarization, it's the lack of illusion of monetarization. We run the biggest Czech Peertube instance and I knew any professional youtubers would be out of our range, but there are thousands of creators with good content, but little or no money from Google and I thought it would be easier to lure them to Peertube since they aren't losing any money doing so.

    But the fact is that many of them live the dream of becoming a professional youtuber. Although they earn no money and 99% of them never will, they still live the dream that maybe one day... And every new follower on YT gets them closer to it and every follower on PT doesn't.

    The whole YouTube thing is perfectly designed monopolistic machine.

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  • rexirexi@mastodon.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 7:29 AM

    @jwildeboer

    sort of the same argument as bandcamp gets a lot of; artists need money, though, and that's a hard prerogative to deny

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  • CoolBlenderKittenCoolBlenderKitten@mastodon.art
    Jul 3, 2026, 7:40 AM

    @jwildeboer
    Yes please. It's one of the evils of our time that by now - and often it's out of necessity - as soon as you think of something nice or find a new hobby, for most people at least the second thought is: how can I make money with this?
    And that, for me, instantly kills all the joy.
    You can't make good art for the money.
    Art it for the joy and pleasure it gives you to express yourself.
    If you can and want to also make money, that should be a side effect not the main purpose.

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  • Aelspireaelspire@aelspire.info
    Jul 3, 2026, 7:49 AM

    @jwildeboer That distinction between for-profit and not-for-profit places helped me to articulate my thoughts, thanks for it! I internally felt than PeerTube and YouTube are different types of things, but I haven't been able to clarify why. It makes a lot of sense to keep those stuff separate! Some people just want space to share their thoughts and socialize, and putting them in the same bag with content creators and influencers who want to make money is terrible idea. Imagine having ad breaks every 5 minutes when talking with your friends IRL! That would be terrible for socializing, but content creators want to make money, so they have completely different needs.

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  • Robert KingettWeirdWriter@caneandable.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 7:51 AM

    I actually want more creatives here, but there's Patreon, there's so many other things other than YT earnings, which are like pennies anyway, but I personally wouldn't take Hacker News seriously on *anything* but I, personally, would love more creative people here. Fedi calls artists influencers all the time, so I don't trust Fedi on who to tell is an influencer or not. That thread, though. Ugh. @jwildeboer

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  • Random Geekrandomgeek@masto.hackers.town
    Jul 3, 2026, 8:12 AM

    @WeirdWriter @jwildeboer I prefer the Fedi approach to social media. I despise our collective attitude towards creative labor as ONLY an ascetic hobby.

    I mean it's not *just* the Fediverse, and there are exceptions. But it ain't the tech. It ain't the architecture. It's the people. Else we'd have folks encouraging Patreon links with the same vigor they encourage alt text.

    Tech's broad revulsion to personal economic reality keeps creative folks hungry & art extraction LLM scrapers validated.

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  • Robert KingettWeirdWriter@caneandable.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 8:45 AM

    Same! And also, honestly? The best art/books/anything I've found has been because "influencers" were sharing their stuff here. I find the best art here because people share their things to buy. @randomgeek @jwildeboer

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  • Jon FAvonVilla@aus.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 8:48 AM

    @jwildeboer My perception of art and information is that it is in essence free. There is pleasure in creating things, having an audience, and/or being part of an audience. In fact many, (or even most) musicians pay to play, and never reach the break even point, or even think about it. So this idea that "artists need to make money" is not so straightforward.

    If you do get to the level of a commercial operation, the whole thing changes, and the monetary prerogatives overwhelm the entire process. The medium is the money. In my view, the monetised process is by default exploitative of both creators and audiences, and overwhelmingly impairs the creation of quality art and information. It's Sturgeon's Law

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  • rainynight65rainynight65@aus.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 9:19 AM

    @jwildeboer Aside from the mindboggling fact that 'professional Youtuber' is a thing, nothing is stopping said professional Youtuber from referencing or linking their Patreon, Ko-Fi and whatever else people use for subs and microdonations these days.

    But I guess what they want is the built-in monetisation features that Youtube gives them and that make monetisation as low-effort as possible. They want that integration between the ecosystems which are an economy of middlemen, passing money back and forth while skimming off the top of every single transaction.

    Oh well.

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  • dan3722SuiGeneris3722@mastodon.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 9:52 AM

    @jwildeboer Exactly. We don't judge a local public library by its failure to generate the same profit margins as an Amazon bookstore. PeerTube isn't trying to be a better business model for professional content creators; it's trying to be a resilient, decentralized protocol for human expression. If a platform's survival depends on ad networks and algorithm hacking, it will inevitably optimize for outrage and retention rather than genuine value.

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  • Erotic Mythology 🌈AimeeMaroux@mastodon.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 10:02 AM

    @jwildeboer I'm not a professional Youtuber but a professional creator. I imagine "lack of monetisation" means that playing an ad roll isn't possible on Peertube? And companies likely don't pay for reading ads on Peertube either?

    Both these models suck ass for the viewer, at least in its current form. There are creators who rely on Patreon et. al. entirely but they are not on Peertube either, possibly because of reach?

    If you make a living with your creations, these things are sadly important.

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  • Jan Wildeboer 😷:krulorange:jwildeboer@social.wildeboer.net
    Jul 3, 2026, 10:05 AM

    @AimeeMaroux Yes. And you have platforms for that to choose from. The question is if a fediverse based platform MUST offer that or of it can coexist without monetisation being a requirement. To me the real question isn't if PeerTube can become an equivalent of or a better YouTube.

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  • Erotic Mythology 🌈AimeeMaroux@mastodon.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 10:12 AM

    @jwildeboer I think as a Youtuber, you don't really have platforms to choose from because there more or less is only Youtube. The only alternative I know that has some people mirroring their YT videos, aside from Fedi, is Odysee. I don't know if they have a monetisation model.

    I don't think ad rolls are a requirement. Many Youtube creators dislike that you can't turn it off on Youtube. But how is artists wanting to make a living wrong?

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  • Jan Wildeboer 😷:krulorange:jwildeboer@social.wildeboer.net
    Jul 3, 2026, 10:19 AM

    @AimeeMaroux Not what I said or meant. I have nothing against monetisation. My question is if monetasiation MUST become an integral part of the fediverse architecture, as is often demanded to become a true alternative to other platforms. I do not support that. I think the fediverse itself should continue to "outsource" that.

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  • Erotic Mythology 🌈AimeeMaroux@mastodon.social
    Jul 3, 2026, 10:25 AM

    @jwildeboer Oh yes, I totally agree on that!
    I find the option to tip tweets on TwitterX totally bizarre, for instance.

    But you do get hostility towards self-promotion on Fedi, which is sad, and I think reach is the biggest factor for professional creators who don't rely on ads because you need to reach a certain amount of people as not everyone will become a patron.

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