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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 8:26 PM

    Transcription in French:

    > Il y a la surface d'attaque, là pour le coup on est pas des spécialistes de la sécurité, donc je ne pourrais pas te répondre avec précision, mais des discussions que j'ai eu, il semblerait que tout ce qu'on fait, ça réduit la surface d'attaque. Donc oui, probablement ça aide. Par contre, on a pas une approche "sécurité durcie", on développe pas un téléphone pour les pédo(bip) pour qu'ils puissent échapper à la justice. Donc il y a pas des trucs pas possibles pour voir

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Replies

  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 8:26 PM

    > si la mémoire est pas corrompue, des trucs de sécu vraiment durcis qui pourraient être utiles clairement pour des dirigeants, dans les services secrets ou que sais-je. C'est pas notre but, notre but c'est de partir d'un constat, aujourd'hui nos données personnelles sont pillées en permanence et ça serait pas légal dans la vraie vie avec le courrier ou le téléphone, on veut changer ça. Donc on vous fait un produit qui change ça par défaut pour n'importe quelle personne.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 8:36 PM

    GrapheneOS exists to protect users from having their privacy invaded by arbitrary individuals, corporations and states. Privacy depends on security. GrapheneOS heavily improves both privacy and security while providing a high level of usability and near perfect app compatibility.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 8:41 PM

    /e/ has far worse privacy and security than the Android Open Source Project. They fail to keep up with important standard privacy and security patches for Android, Linux, firmware, drivers and HALs. They fail to provide current generation Android privacy and security protections.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 8:43 PM

    For years, Gaël Duval has spearheaded a campaign to misrepresent GrapheneOS as not being usable, not compatible with apps and only useful to a tiny minority of people. He has repeatedly claimed GrapheneOS is for pedophiles, criminals and spies while claiming /e/ is for everyone.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 8:50 PM

    It's hardly only GrapheneOS focusing on protecting users against exploits. Apple and Google have put a ton of work into it. Apple heavily focuses on privacy and security. That includes protecting against remote exploits, local exploits from compromised apps and data extraction.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 8:54 PM

    GrapheneOS and iOS are both heavily focused on privacy and security. Both are gradually adding much stronger protections against apps/sites scraping data, coercion users into giving data via alternatives with case-by-case consent and increasingly strong exploit protections.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 8:56 PM

    /e/ is far weaker in all of these areas compared to the standard Android Open Source Project on secure hardware. It doesn't keep up with standards updates and protections. It adds tons of low security attack surface and privacy invasive services. It's not in the same space as us.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:02 PM

    /e/ and Murena devices are far worse for privacy and security than an iPhone. It's trivial to break into their devices remotely or extract data from them compared to an iPhone. They have weaker privacy protections from apps too. Their main approach to privacy is a DNS blocklist.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:04 PM

    Their DNS blocklist can only block domains not used for useful functionality to avoid ruining usability. Meanwhile, the most privacy invasive behavior by apps is rarely ever split out into separate domains. Even for those, apps and websites can trivially evade DNS blocklists.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:06 PM

    It's common for apps and websites to do everything through their own servers. That's best practice to avoid leaking API keys. It's increasingly common for invasive libraries to use hard-wired IPs and/or DNS-over-HTTPS to evade blocking. DNS filtering is increasingly less useful.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:09 PM

    Murena is a for-profit company owned by shareholders including Gaël Duval. /e/ has a non-profit organization which is also led by Gaël Duval. /e/ includes paid services from Murena. /e/ very clearly exists to build products for Murena to sell in order to enrich the shareholders.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:13 PM

    Despite being done for profit, /e/ receives millions of euros in funding from the EU on an ongoing basis. /e/ and Murena use extraordinarily inaccurate marketing to not only promote their products/services but also to mislead people about GrapheneOS and scare them away from it.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:18 PM

    Recently, France's national law enforcement began fearmongering about GrapheneOS and smearing it with inaccurate claims. France's corporate and state media heavily participated. Many articles and also radio/television coverage misrepresented GrapheneOS as being for criminals.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:24 PM

    Across French corporate and state media covering it, inaccurate claims by the state about features, distribution and marketing of GrapheneOS were wrongly presented as fact. Most of them didn't contact us and we weren't shown what was being claimed so we could properly respond.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:33 PM

    Here are several particularly egregious examples:

    leparisien.fr/faits-divers/tel

    leparisien.fr/faits-divers/goo

    franceinfo.fr/faits-divers/nar

    Gaël Duval and Murena participated in these attacks. They even spread harassment content towards our team and shared it with sites attacking us.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:37 PM

    /e/ and Murena are based in France. They've been pushing false narratives about GrapheneOS falsely claiming it isn't usable by regular people and doesn't benefit them for years. Duval has been making the ludicrous claim GrapheneOS is only useful to criminals and spies for years.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:40 PM

    /e/ and Murena aren't on the same side as GrapheneOS. They're charlatans selling devices with poor privacy and atrocious security to earn money. They've spent years trying to undermine a legitimate privacy project and heavily use the same talking points as police state advocates.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:44 PM

    Their marketing heavily focuses on avoiding Google and gives the impression they believe privacy means avoiding one company. Meanwhile, they add a bunch of Google services not present in the Android Open Source Project and give extensive privileged access to Google apps/services.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:52 PM

    /e/ and Murena have repeatedly claimed GrapheneOS is for drug dealers, pedophiles, terrorists and spies. /e/ and Murena are anti-privacy. They're heavily profiting from marketing products as private but don't believe in it. /e/ is an authoritarian-aligned fake privacy project.

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  • Seancodebam@mstdn.ca
    Apr 5, 2026, 8:48 PM

    @GrapheneOS

    "heard that you were popping /e/"
    "stop resorting to the vowel"

    -Logic

    idk I'm bored

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  • josecastrillo@mastodon.online
    Apr 5, 2026, 8:48 PM

    @GrapheneOS woo interesting I didn't know those declaration from Gael 😵‍💫 about you as project

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  • David Penfold :verified:davep@infosec.exchange
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:39 PM

    @GrapheneOS Le Parisien :

    "Ces engins jusqu’à présent inviolés, qui protègent les communications et qui ne partagent pas les données sur les serveurs, sont un nouveau défi que le parquet cyber entend bientôt relever."

    C'est exactement pareil avec Signal sur Android si on n'utilise pas le cloud, ils nous prennent pour des imbéciles.

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  • XtreixXtreix@infosec.exchange
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:50 PM

    @davep @GrapheneOS Hahaha, furthermore, this false claim makes no sense: GrapheneOS does not route user communications through these servers; GrapheneOS is not a company and does not offer services such as messaging or email etc.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 10, 2026, 5:33 PM

    @fla Here's one of many cases you can hear it in his own words:

    projets-libres.org/en/podcast/

    > The European Union has subsidized us to the tune of several million for this project.

    You can find the details of the millions of euros in funding being given to /e/ and how /e/ is heavily influencing where the money is going. They're steering government funding towards themselves and projects aligned with them. Many of these projects have a history of attacking the GrapheneOS project and our team.

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  • Seancodebam@mstdn.ca
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:00 PM

    @GrapheneOS to be fair they don't promise security, only privacy. at least in their foreword on their website here.

    I don't think it's by accident that they don't even use the word secure, or security, on the whole page.

    e.foundation/e-os/

    I've seen claims before where they claim it's better than GrapheneOS. But in what regard? Maybe degoogling and having alternatives pre-installed? GrapheneOS is probably more involved to get the same apps. That's the only way /e/ is better in my opinion

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  • Seancodebam@mstdn.ca
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:02 PM

    @GrapheneOS but I'm fine with not even comparing them. grapheneos is an OS and /e/ is a ROM

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  • Seancodebam@mstdn.ca
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:25 PM

    @HybridStaticAnimate @GrapheneOS fair enough, I was just calling it a ROM in the sense that it's just as insecure, if not more, than the ROMs (or operating systems) people were flashing directly to their /system and /data partitions back in like 2014

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  • HybridStaticAnimateHybridStaticAnimate@infosec.exchange
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:12 PM

    @codebam @GrapheneOS

    They dont provide privacy. So a promise is already broken. But beyond that, privacy cannot exist without security. They arent mutually exclusive, they are intertwined. To ignore security means you are not a privacy project.

    E/ is not better at degoogling. GrapheneOS does not connect to any google servers, run any google play code, have any privilege google services, etc. Sandboxed google play is sandboxed and must be installed by the user. All default connections are to first party servers hosted by GOS. It is not more involved to get the same apps, google or otherwise.

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  • Claudius Linkrealn2s@infosec.exchange
    Apr 6, 2026, 3:49 AM

    @HybridStaticAnimate @codebam @GrapheneOS

    That it must be installed by the user doesn't make it different.

    IMHO the two app stores included in GrapheneOS are not sufficient for the vast majority of users.

    If "every" user needs to install it to have a usable phone, it really is part of the attack surface.
    (And yes, I'm aware the Play services are sandboxed on GrapheneOS which improves privacy and security)

    It's a bit like delivering a computer without network functionality because it reduces the attack surface, and then blaming the user if they install network drivers.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 6, 2026, 1:12 PM

    @realn2s @HybridStaticAnimate @codebam

    > IMHO the two app stores included in GrapheneOS are not sufficient for the vast majority of users.

    Our own App Store is the only one included in GrapheneOS. We don't bundle third party apps and services into the OS. Using those is entirely a user choice and will remain that way.

    Our App Store provides Accrescent and the Play Store. If you think other apps such as Obtainium should be easily available then get those to submit their apps into Accrescent.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 6, 2026, 1:08 PM

    @codebam /e/ doesn't have similar privacy protections as GrapheneOS. Unlike GrapheneOS, /e/ connects to a bunch of Google services by default and also unlike GrapheneOS gives extensions privileged access to Google apps and services. We don't use the term degoogled and it's not the purpose of GrapheneOS but GrapheneOS does only connect to our own servers by default and does not give any privileged access to installed Google apps without the user explicitly enabling narrow forms via a few toggles.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 6, 2026, 1:09 PM

    @codebam /e/ fails to keep up with standard privacy patches and fails to provide standard privacy protections. /e/ has privacy invasive apps and services included. They have user tracking via a unique random identifier in their update client and multiple invasive services which are marketed as private when they aren't. They've had issues including leaking files stored in their cloud server to other users which turned out to clearly not actually be E2EE. Privacy also heavily depends on security.

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  • SenioradminHaydar@social.tchncs.de
    Apr 8, 2026, 6:39 PM

    @GrapheneOS So, your recommendation is, if I don't want to buy a Google Pixel, to buy an iPhone instead of another Android phone which can run LineageOS? Just asking for clarification.

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  • Blue Lumablueluma@mastodon.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:12 PM

    @GrapheneOS I don't think you should attack frontally others like that whenever 😶

    Reminding security is privacy is good.
    Responding to attacks is good (which is not the case *here*)

    I understand its CEO and the Murena company might have attack the GrapheneOS project in the past, and responding to that was normal too.

    But I don't see attacking /e/OS like that often as a positive feedback in general. A simple reminder could have been enough.

    ❤️ on the GrapheneOS project btw

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  • Blue Lumablueluma@mastodon.social
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:14 PM

    @GrapheneOS I prefer seeing post about GrapheneOS or Android security from your account than continous attacks on other projects (even if they are legitimatel), but that's my personal opinion

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 6, 2026, 1:49 PM

    @blueluma /e/, Murena and Duval have been continuously attacking the GrapheneOS project for many years. They've misled a huge number of people about what GrapheneOS provides. Many people wrongly believe GrapheneOS isn't for them because of this.

    GrapheneOS is a highly usable OS with far broader app compatibility than /e/. Unlike /e/, GrapheneOS has major privacy enhancements instead of rolling back privacy compared to the Android Open Source Project. /e/ adds a bunch of invasive apps/services.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 6, 2026, 1:53 PM

    @blueluma Gaël Duval has repeatedly claimed serious privacy and security projects are only for pedophiles, criminals and spies. They've specifically said this about GrapheneOS many times but have also attacked Signal before too.

    Duval, /e/ and Murena aren't on the same side. They're doing what they think will make them money which is compromising between privacy and state access. They present protecting privacy from more than American corporations as nefarious. They're undermining privacy.

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  • XtreixXtreix@infosec.exchange
    Apr 5, 2026, 9:32 PM

    @blueluma @GrapheneOS

    "I don't think you should attack frontally others like that whenever"

    Gael Duval attack GrapheneOS, GrapheneOS responds to these attacks.

    "I understand its CEO and the Murena company might have attack the GrapheneOS project in the past"

    It's not in the past, these attacks are recuring, and he does it again in this recent video. Duval has been waging a disinformation campaign against GOS for years.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 6, 2026, 1:20 AM

    @blueluma @Xtreix It's a response to a long series of attacks by Duval on GrapheneOS claiming it's only useful for pedophiles, criminals and spies. He didn't specifically name GrapheneOS as part of the interview we showed a clip from but he certainly has elsewhere on a regular basis. We felt people would take it more seriously with him saying it out loud in a video as opposed to his regular posts across platforms where he says it. That's why we chose this over the many other cases he did it.

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  • SomeAnoTooterSomeAnoTooter@mastodon.online
    Apr 6, 2026, 6:53 AM

    @GrapheneOS @blueluma @Xtreix I also think it's not the best to directly attack them and others. Stating that GOS is better than others and how smooth it works can be presented in a better way. I'm not a PR specialist but disputing false claims maybe can be done in a better way without "sounding desperate". Sry not native English and therefore don't finding the right words.
    GOS is strong and works nice and I I'm so excited about the Motorola cooperation. Keep on with this awesome work.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 6, 2026, 1:57 PM

    @SomeAnoTooter @blueluma @Xtreix The way we're handling it is working fine. /e/ and Murena are enemies of privacy as they've made clear by repeatedly claiming serious privacy protections are only for pedophiles, criminals and spies. This isn't the first time they're saying it.

    They're promoting an approach where they avoid some Google apps/services while adding a bunch of Google services to the OS and use DNS filtering to block low hanging fruit but not the most privacy invasive behavior.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 6, 2026, 1:58 PM

    @SomeAnoTooter @blueluma @Xtreix DNS filtering is not a serious approach to privacy. It does not stop apps sending whatever they want to whoever they want. In practice, it does not stop nearly any of the most privacy invasive behavior because it's done via the same domains as the useful functionality and they aren't blocking that. It's trivial for apps to bypass and many are doing it by having fallback to hard-wired IPs or using their own DNS resolution from the beginning to entirely bypass it.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 6, 2026, 2:01 PM

    @SomeAnoTooter @blueluma @Xtreix Murena and /e/ are undermining privacy as a whole by repeatedly claiming in multiple formats that serious privacy and security protections as only being for pedophiles, criminals and spies. Since they're presenting themselves as advocates for privacy selling privacy products, the fact that they're pushing these talking points makes it far more damaging. It's going to contribute to the ongoing crackdown on privacy and encryption in France. They're not allies.

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  • Blue Lumablueluma@mastodon.social
    Apr 6, 2026, 12:51 AM

    @Xtreix @GrapheneOS I've only watched the short section of the videos from the post, do you have a source of the complete video so I could watch it and see the direct attack to GrapheneOS in it as you mention 👀

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  • XtreixXtreix@infosec.exchange
    Apr 6, 2026, 8:15 AM

    @blueluma @GrapheneOS Duval's statement at 5:07:

    “We don't have a hardened security approach, we're not developing a phone so that pedophiles (word censored in the video) can evade justice.

    So there aren't any advanced features, like checking if the memory is corrupted, etc, really hardened features that might be useful for presidents, secret agents, and so on...”

    The reference to a hardened phone intended for pedophiles is a direct reference to GrapheneOS, the only hardened mobile operating system available, as well as to phones compatible with the project and any other projects or devices that might adopt the same approach. These verbal statements follow a long series of false claims about GrapheneOS on social media.

    He then states that this hardening may prove effective, but continues with the fallacious logic that it is useful only for high-value, targeted individuals or criminals, and that lambda people would never need it and would have no reason to use enhanced security to protect their data. He claims that GrapheneOS is for a minority and that /e/OS is for everyone.

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  • GrapheneOSGrapheneOS@grapheneos.social
    Apr 6, 2026, 2:16 PM

    @blueluma @Xtreix We didn't say that but rather said Apple is doing similar work on seriously protecting people's privacy and security including from sophisticated attacks. Sophisticated attacks may be done by state actors but aren't exclusive to them. They're also hardly strictly very targeted attacks but rather are also deployed quite broadly. Apple has at least publicly taken a stance similar to GrapheneOS of trying to protect users against state surveillance with technical measures.

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