@whack @Lunaphied because it's really pissing me off how the very concept of portability continues to get construed as if it's not an actually noble attempt to empower the disenfranchised. fascists don't like portability. they like constant change and incompatibility
Oct 13, 2026, 1:53 AM@hipsterelectron @Lunaphied yeah the fragmentation encouraged by the transition to Wayland hasn’t been great. Instead of targeting “Linux x11” congrats we get to target, separately, gnome and KDE and sway and niri and cosmic and 🫠
@hipsterelectron @whack to be fair I think a lot of people who complain about the state of things aren't appreciating decades of X11 consolidation resulting in essentially a single codebase serving everyone which is honestly not a normal case for something so dynamic. I'm encouraged by the efforts toward a window management protocol. Of all places Mir seems to be one of the more open projects.
I think if people experienced the long rollout of X11 extensions they'd also be frustrated. That being said RDP exposes all the primitives you need theoretically, so simply switch to RDP as the display server protocol
Oct 13, 2026, 6:16 AM@Lunaphied @hipsterelectron yeah it’s been a wild road. I was around during the xfree86->xorg transition back in my FreeBSD days. I’ve even made my own window manager for a while.
But I don’t have the kind of time I used to when I was in my 20s… so hacking and bodging my way to victory on existing platforms is the only real way forward for me, often despite the angry noises the maintainers make in my direction.
I had the same experiences maintaining fpm— users love it, package system maintainers have mixed responses. I know some Debian and redhat folks hate that it exists. Such is life.
@whack @hipsterelectron i definitely don't have the same kind of energy anymore (chronic fatigue fucking sucks but it especially sucks when you have a million projects. Much as they're maligned, LLMs can make a big difference between never having anything and having a few projects moving).
Honestly I never touched fpm. What I do know is that open source communities spend a lot of time fighting things that are essentially inevitable (and I don't mean LLMs I don't think they are) and I wish a lot of that "avoid systemd/Wayland" energy was pushed towards accepting limitations and collaborating to fix problems.
That being said if nobody wants to listen, much like protests, nothing can be achieved :/
I might've used xfree86 back in the day because of Windows of all things. That sure was a time period haha.
Speaking of energy one thing I've always wanted to do is reverse engineer the protocol macOS uses (Windows is basically public/cursed because it's all just syscalls directly hooked to drivers I think?)
Oct 13, 2026, 6:36 AM@Lunaphied @hipsterelectron all the anti-systemd and anti-Wayland behaviors mostly just balkanized various groups and made everything slower and angrier. Nobody wins.
I played my part in the systemd wars by writing a tool (pleaserun) that made service definitions for whatever you want - sysv, runit, upstart, systemd, etc. I don’t have an strong opinion against these things, I just wanna use the computer 😂
@whack @hipsterelectron yeah exactly
@Lunaphied @whack i would totally accept this take. this is definitely the kind of insight i don't have because i find window systems exhausting. thanks a lot luna
Oct 13, 2026, 6:09 PM@hipsterelectron @Lunaphied ++ That basically describes my experience -- I'm frustrated by the slow motions, and the maintainer's fear of creating another X11 is ... causing the creation of another X11 but we're calling it a different name (Wayland + XDG Portals). The technology improves, but the sociopolitical structures seem the same. :'(
@whack @hipsterelectron honestly I have full faith that everyone (besides GNOME) will come up with something good in the end. I have full confidence also that this will be made more difficult by GNOME. Less confident if that will be in bad or good faith
@hipsterelectron @whack (our name isn't Luna but I accept the abbreviation since I don't directly attach a name (here))
Also yeah window systems are exhausting but unfortunately my brain decided that GPU drivers and are interesting and we cycle through it every so often whenever we want something stupid to work on our computer. One day I'll somehow wake up from a nap and be truly awake and infinitely powerful to get software done